"It is now evident that an ugly campaign is underway not merely to misrepresent the health insurance reform legislation, but to disrupt public meetings and prevent members of Congress and constituents from conducting a civil dialogue. These tactics have included hanging in effigy one Democratic member of Congress in Maryland and protesters holding a sign displaying a tombstone with the name of another congressman in Texas, where protesters also shouted "Just say no!" drowning out those who wanted to hold a substantive discussion."
If you protest a Republican speaker using similiar tactics it's dissent right?
"These disruptions are occurring because opponents are afraid not just of differing views — but of the facts themselves. Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American."
I have seen plenty of videos, and news accounts over the last eight years of left leaning protestors using the same tactics (or worse) and yet that was dissent and perfectly American right?
Don't get me wrong I think there is a much better way of going about it, but shouting in a town hall is anything but Un-American...
'If you protest a Republican speaker using similiar tactics it's dissent right?'
No, then it's a crime and you are removed immediately, or tear-gassed, or detained. Compare and contrast, man brings gun to Obama event -- nothing happens. Woman brings t-shirt to Bush event --- she is arrested and detained.
Double standard? Yes, because the Bush administration was far more fascist in practice.
Disrupting the democratic process isn't unAmerican so much as anti-American. Dissent is noble when being against killing Americans for no reason, it's just sad to dissent against because 'It's not my country anymore...' wahh!!! That's right it's not, the Klan is out of power, get used to it.
However you are mistaken about what Pelosi actually said...
"A]s members of Congress spend time at home during August, they are talking with their constituents about reform. The dialogue between elected representatives and constituents is at the heart of our democracy and plays an integral role in assuring that the legislation we write reflects the genuine needs and concerns of the people we represent.
However, it is now evident that an ugly campaign is underway not merely to misrepresent the health insurance reform legislation, but to disrupt public meetings and prevent members of Congress and constituents from conducting a civil dialogue. These tactics have included hanging in effigy one Democratic member of Congress in Maryland and protesters holding a sign displaying a tombstone with the name of another congressman in Texas, where protesters also shouted "Just say no!" drowning out those who wanted to hold a substantive discussion.
Let the facts be heard
These disruptions are occurring because opponents are afraid not just of differing views -- but of the facts themselves. Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American. Drowning out the facts is how we failed at this task for decades.
Health care is complex. It touches every American life. It drives our economy. People must be allowed to learn the facts. [USA Today, 8/10/09] "
So let me get this straight, a double standard is okay because the previous Administration was worse?
"Disrupting the democratic process isn't unAmerican so much as anti-American."
What democratic process has been disrupted? A group of angry Americans speaking there minds in a town hall forum is now Anti-American?
"Dissent is noble when being against killing Americans for no reason, it's just sad to dissent against because 'It's not my country anymore...' wahh!!!"
So dissent is noble only when protesting against a war? Did I read too much into this? Please clarify for me.
By the way it's still my Country, as it was still yours eight years ago. Yes, I don't like where my Country is going; yet am I somehow not a noble American just because I disagree or "dissent"?
"That's right it's not, the Klan is out of power, get used to it."
Was the Klan in power and I just didn't know it? Get used to it? Get used to what? Are you implying I am in with the Klan crowd and somehow miss the meetings and just need to, "get used to it"?
I do agree with you that the health care debate is very complex. Dispite the diruptions, has the powers that be (Not the Klan) done a good job at explaining anything? I would say no...
The Klan once DID have a lot of political power. It went a long way in influence. You still see permutations of the twentieth century in the world today, you've seen them..their the ones who draw little Hitler mustaches on Obama, and ask why they can't see his birth certificate. Now, I was NOT implying you are part of the Klan. That was the continuation of my thought after typing, 'It's not my country anymore...' insinuating that a sentiment such as that drips with racial animus.
When people show up for a town hall, and otherwise disrupt the proceedings, it is a disruption of the Democratic process. Coercion through threat is terrorism. Why didn't they allow people to speak? Why threaten to dismantle Democracy? That is truly anti-American.
It is not that they have different opinions, it is that they think they are the only ones. It is otherwise uncivil, and reeks of tyranny. They seem so addicted to power that they are willing to take it back by force. The danger posed by the radical right is too real to be ignored.
Now I have more sympathy for the people who were annoyed by some liberal protesters, though I can actually understand being upset about the war.
"The danger posed by the radical right is too real to be ignored."
I would add that the same can be said for the radical Left. I think that's where/why I and people like me are getting anxious with what's going on in Washington... It isn't a right vs Left thing as much as it's a radical vs radical thing.
I am a staunch conservative on some issues, moderate on some, and I would say liberal on others... I don't fit into the nice neat little evil Republican box. I am not radical nor would I say are most Americans. Just my .02
Centrist policies, reaching for bipartisan consensus, Republicans in his cabinet, not prosecuting the former administration for war crimes, using the Congress to implement bills, always compromising on those bills...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYlZiWK2Iy8&feature=player_embedded
ReplyDeleteWe need more democrats like Barney:
ReplyDeletehttp://tinyurl.com/p2foej
Right on, Barney.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the link, Ajai.
And Chris Dodd...
ReplyDeleteHe's alight, but Barney's the man!
ReplyDeleteHow about Pelosi? She is doing a bang up job, Huh?
ReplyDeleteYeah, she's pretty cool, I like how she stands up for the public option.
ReplyDeleteI like how she says I am Un-American for being leary of it... She's a real super neat lady.
ReplyDeleteBesides dissent is so last year.
No, she never said you were un-American.
ReplyDelete"It is now evident that an ugly campaign is underway not merely to misrepresent the health insurance reform legislation, but to disrupt public meetings and prevent members of Congress and constituents from conducting a civil dialogue. These tactics have included hanging in effigy one Democratic member of Congress in Maryland and protesters holding a sign displaying a tombstone with the name of another congressman in Texas, where protesters also shouted "Just say no!" drowning out those who wanted to hold a substantive discussion."
ReplyDeleteIf you protest a Republican speaker using similiar tactics it's dissent right?
"These disruptions are occurring because opponents are afraid not just of differing views — but of the facts themselves. Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American."
I have seen plenty of videos, and news accounts over the last eight years of left leaning protestors using the same tactics (or worse) and yet that was dissent and perfectly American right?
Don't get me wrong I think there is a much better way of going about it, but shouting in a town hall is anything but Un-American...
'If you protest a Republican speaker using similiar tactics it's dissent right?'
ReplyDeleteNo, then it's a crime and you are removed immediately, or tear-gassed, or detained. Compare and contrast, man brings gun to Obama event -- nothing happens. Woman brings t-shirt to Bush event --- she is arrested and detained.
Double standard? Yes, because the Bush administration was far more fascist in practice.
Disrupting the democratic process isn't unAmerican so much as anti-American.
Dissent is noble when being against killing Americans for no reason, it's just sad to dissent against because 'It's not my country anymore...' wahh!!! That's right it's not, the Klan is out of power, get used to it.
However you are mistaken about what Pelosi actually said...
"A]s members of Congress spend time at home during August, they are talking with their constituents about reform. The dialogue between elected representatives and constituents is at the heart of our democracy and plays an integral role in assuring that the legislation we write reflects the genuine needs and concerns of the people we represent.
However, it is now evident that an ugly campaign is underway not merely to misrepresent the health insurance reform legislation, but to disrupt public meetings and prevent members of Congress and constituents from conducting a civil dialogue. These tactics have included hanging in effigy one Democratic member of Congress in Maryland and protesters holding a sign displaying a tombstone with the name of another congressman in Texas, where protesters also shouted "Just say no!" drowning out those who wanted to hold a substantive discussion.
Let the facts be heard
These disruptions are occurring because opponents are afraid not just of differing views -- but of the facts themselves. Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American. Drowning out the facts is how we failed at this task for decades.
Health care is complex. It touches every American life. It drives our economy. People must be allowed to learn the facts. [USA Today, 8/10/09] "
http://mediamatters.org/research/200908110030
So let me get this straight, a double standard is okay because the previous Administration was worse?
ReplyDelete"Disrupting the democratic process isn't unAmerican so much as anti-American."
What democratic process has been disrupted? A group of angry Americans speaking there minds in a town hall forum is now Anti-American?
"Dissent is noble when being against killing Americans for no reason, it's just sad to dissent against because 'It's not my country anymore...' wahh!!!"
So dissent is noble only when protesting against a war? Did I read too much into this? Please clarify for me.
By the way it's still my Country, as it was still yours eight years ago. Yes, I don't like where my Country is going; yet am I somehow not a noble American just because I disagree or "dissent"?
"That's right it's not, the Klan is out of power, get used to it."
Was the Klan in power and I just didn't know it? Get used to it? Get used to what? Are you implying I am in with the Klan crowd and somehow miss the meetings and just need to, "get used to it"?
I do agree with you that the health care debate is very complex. Dispite the diruptions, has the powers that be (Not the Klan) done a good job at explaining anything? I would say no...
ooops, "their" minds...
ReplyDeleteThe Klan once DID have a lot of political power. It went a long way in influence. You still see permutations of the twentieth century in the world today, you've seen them..their the ones who draw little Hitler mustaches on Obama, and ask why they can't see his birth certificate. Now, I was NOT implying you are part of the Klan. That was the continuation of my thought after typing, 'It's not my country anymore...' insinuating that a sentiment such as that drips with racial animus.
ReplyDeleteWhen people show up for a town hall, and otherwise disrupt the proceedings, it is a disruption of the Democratic process. Coercion through threat is terrorism. Why didn't they allow people to speak? Why threaten to dismantle Democracy? That is truly anti-American.
It is not that they have different opinions, it is that they think they are the only ones. It is otherwise uncivil, and reeks of tyranny. They seem so addicted to power that they are willing to take it back by force. The danger posed by the radical right is too real to be ignored.
Now I have more sympathy for the people who were annoyed by some liberal protesters, though I can actually understand being upset about the war.
Fair enough, I see your point.
ReplyDelete"The danger posed by the radical right is too real to be ignored."
I would add that the same can be said for the radical Left. I think that's where/why I and people like me are getting anxious with what's going on in Washington... It isn't a right vs Left thing as much as it's a radical vs radical thing.
I am a staunch conservative on some issues, moderate on some, and I would say liberal on others... I don't fit into the nice neat little evil Republican box. I am not radical nor would I say are most Americans. Just my .02
I see the Obama administration as pretty moderate.
ReplyDeletePlease do tell... How so?
ReplyDeleteCentrist policies, reaching for bipartisan consensus, Republicans in his cabinet, not prosecuting the former administration for war crimes, using the Congress to implement bills, always compromising on those bills...
ReplyDeleteIf anything he's too conservative. Hopefully that will change soon...
ReplyDelete