I was emailing Barefoot quite a bit right after he was banned. I actually met him for coffee one day! Crazy guy, but you knew that. Then the emails sort of dwindled. He did contact me about 2 weeks ago, said he was banned from another blog site, one about gun rights...I can only imagine.
I tried many times to get him to post here. I don't know what his hesitation is.
When I started this, I invited BF, but he said he wasn't interested in "preaching to the choir". While COE does a great job of representing a more conservative stance, I do wish we had more folks to back him up.
In part, this is why I don't tend to post too much...don't want him to feel all beaten up (tho, I know he can handle himself very well). I must say, there's been some excellent discussions without me (he wrote with a slight tear in his eye). ;0)
"and Vicky and MO3 have some pretty conservative opinions, at times."
Pretty conservative? My father-in-law, an avid Fox News, et al. supporter, would choke on his steak (out of laughter) if he heard this. Perhaps slightly conservative. I guess it's all relative.
I only consider myself conservative on the point of Constitutional rights. I will defend even the right to bear (some) arms, however I support all the gun control laws we can possibly pass in this country because I really am anti-gun.
I'm not really fiscally conservative either. I don't like government waste, but I'm all for taxes supporting good social programs.
As for social issues, I think I'm pretty damned liberal.
I think this proves how limited labels, and language itself can be. Traditionally, I think liberal simply meant someone who was open to changing the status quo. The terms liberal and conservative change over time. Really, when you think about it, libertarians are a group that fundamentally support the most liberal of ideas, that of personal freedom above all. But they are for limited government at the same time, and this idea is associated with conservatives.
Good think TruthTeller is not around. We'd be subjected to a treatise on the definitions of liberal and conservative, with long quotes and references to this or that dictionary.
Let's see...I am pro-choice, support same-sex marriage AND adoption, don't support a huge military and despise imperialism, think pot should be legal, am against the death penalty, support less jails and more drug rehab (i.e., I think 3-strikes-you're-out is a bad idea), support heavily protecting the environment (e.g., no drilling in ANWR), support women's and minorities' rights (i.e., equal pay for equal work), am against censorship, support privacy (i.e., I think the Patriot Act sucks), support heavy gun control, support alternative energy, support single-payer health care, don't believe in unbridled capitalism nor the military-industrial complex, think social-security, welfare, and medicare are vital to our society, support public education and oppose a voucher system, don't support prayer in school, don't support an open border but do not support laws that limit education and health-care for illegal immigrants...
I think I'm on the left...(maybe feeling a bit defensive about the conservative tag).
umm...Euthanasia? Palestine? Heroin needle exchange? Third-trimester abortions? Suffrage? Scary rock race music? Food stamps in liquors stores condoms in schools...funding, Big Government, tax the rich and eat them...
Americore working, ACORN volunteering, community organizing, embryonic stem-cell using, squatting up a tree, labor supporting, Godless, knower of useless knowledge Darwinian....sorry, I'm having too much fun.
Totally agree with you on the label game. I have some conservative views too. I can't really think of any right now, but I'll get back to you when I do.
"Pro Affirmative Action?" That depends. If you mean a quota system, then no, I am not pro affirmative action. Basically I think this is an outdated action and that discrimination in employment should be taken on a case by case basis.
Euthanasia...you mean death with dignity, I think, a definite yes. Palestine... to be honest I don't know all the intricacies of what has gone on there and I never commented on this in the GT, except perhaps to say that one of Al Qaeda's gripes is our policy on Israel. I think there have been f-ups on both sides. Heroin needle exchange, yes, it's stupid not to. Third trimester abortions, that one is very tough and I would say that it depends on the situation and I am not clear on where I stand there. Suffrage, how do you mean? Scary rock race music...what is that? If you mean offensive lyrics, then I think they are tasteless but I wouldn't ban them. Food stamps in liquor stores: I don't think anyone should monitor where food stamps are spent as long as they are spent on food. Condoms in schools, yes. Define big government, tax the rich...actually I like the idea of a flat tax but there would be no write offs, definitely eat them.
"Are you so open-minded that you disagree with yourself?"
Yes, I am...no you're not...
I think Afghanistan is a good example of this. I honestly don't know where I stand on it. We shouldn't have ever been there in the first place but we left it a mess when we abandoned it and let the Taliban take over (Charlie Wilson's War was a pretty good synopsis of this).
This is where it gets confusing for me. Often times 'Conservatism' really alters things while pretending to preserve them, or it is actually a change in the name of 'conservatism. Not just protecting the status quo, but empowering it or eliminating everything else.
Anyways, to me repealing DOMA, and DADT and Bush tax cuts would be conservative, as well as protecting the environment.
Once I heard 'Gay is the new Black,' or put more cutely 'Pink is the new Black.' a couple of years back. I was like, no, I'm pretty sure Black is still Black, except for that one fashion season where it was all about having a Brown wardrobe.
"'Conservatism' really alters things while pretending to preserve them"
Yep. Prayer in schools is a good example. If you are truly conservative you should want to protect the separation of church and state as it is stated in the constitution (yes, I know, I know...those exact words aren't in there...). But the religious right are on the 'conservative' side, meaning the right, so their mandate becomes the conservative mandate. Very confusing, I'd say.
Let me see, I support low taxes, a small central/Federal Government, with local/State Governments beholden to the People. I support the Constitution (with the 2nd amendment). I support gun control laws that make sense. I am against censorship, and all for privacy. I support our “Strong” military, while I agree that imperialism is a bad thing but don’t think we are imperialistic.
I support same sex marriage. On the fence on adoption, I am pro-life; against the death penalty (Until it affects me then I may have to change my mind). I don’t think Pot should be legal. I am all for conservation and environmental protection but think we have gone way too far in some ways.
I do not support socialized medicine; I will not support anymore welfare programs as we are already living with a nanny/welfare State. I support education, and think voucher programs should be given a shot. We’ve poured more money over the years into education will little improvement, why not? I think mandatory minimums (Three strikes) make sense to a point, but think they ultimately take our Judges discretion away. I love capitalism, despise communism, and dislike very much socialism.
I support a closed border and do not support amnesty or any laws that make use of our tax money to pay for “illegal” immigrants to pay for health care or our School systems.
Last but not least, I agree that the separation of Church and State is a good thing. Along with the separation of powers which we seem to get further and further away from each election cycle…
On the fence about adoption? There are many children in the world who do not know what it is like to be loved and protected. Wish so many unwanted children in the world, it is beyond cruel to deny them a loving family that can provide for them.
Oh wait, Since the Republican leadership can't possibly be swayed how can all us underling sheep be able to see our way through to that new fangled logic thingy?
Nice post, Corvallisoreugene! Based on some of your positions, listed above, I'd almost call you a "liberal"! Ya left wing nut! Next time, let's have coffee at the bean! ;0)
I'm with Ajai on the adoption thing. But, I think if you spent more time with members of the GLBT community, you would, fairly quickly, change your mind.
In the meantime, I'm on the fence about letting evangelical Christians adopt impressionable youth. But, that probably has more to do with my own bias than their ability to raise children.
I will have to see if I can pull out my Burkenstocks, and ty-dye tee-shirt(s)... Kidding aside, let me know your schedule and we'll have to do that. Does the Bean have hot coco? We should all get together!
I was emailing Barefoot quite a bit right after he was banned. I actually met him for coffee one day! Crazy guy, but you knew that. Then the emails sort of dwindled. He did contact me about 2 weeks ago, said he was banned from another blog site, one about gun rights...I can only imagine.
ReplyDeleteI tried many times to get him to post here. I don't know what his hesitation is.
When I started this, I invited BF, but he said he wasn't interested in "preaching to the choir". While COE does a great job of representing a more conservative stance, I do wish we had more folks to back him up.
ReplyDeleteIn part, this is why I don't tend to post too much...don't want him to feel all beaten up (tho, I know he can handle himself very well). I must say, there's been some excellent discussions without me (he wrote with a slight tear in his eye). ;0)
Being the only one of me, and Vicky and MO3 have some pretty conservative opinions, at times. But I guess Conservative is the new gay.
ReplyDeleteBut I'm all for encouraging more writers of any stripe.
ReplyDelete"and Vicky and MO3 have some pretty conservative opinions, at times."
ReplyDeletePretty conservative? My father-in-law, an avid Fox News, et al. supporter, would choke on his steak (out of laughter) if he heard this. Perhaps slightly conservative. I guess it's all relative.
I only consider myself conservative on the point of Constitutional rights. I will defend even the right to bear (some) arms, however I support all the gun control laws we can possibly pass in this country because I really am anti-gun.
I'm not really fiscally conservative either. I don't like government waste, but I'm all for taxes supporting good social programs.
As for social issues, I think I'm pretty damned liberal.
I think this proves how limited labels, and language itself can be. Traditionally, I think liberal simply meant someone who was open to changing the status quo. The terms liberal and conservative change over time. Really, when you think about it, libertarians are a group that fundamentally support the most liberal of ideas, that of personal freedom above all. But they are for limited government at the same time, and this idea is associated with conservatives.
ReplyDeleteIt's all just words...
Good think TruthTeller is not around. We'd be subjected to a treatise on the definitions of liberal and conservative, with long quotes and references to this or that dictionary.
ReplyDeleteLet's see...I am pro-choice, support same-sex marriage AND adoption, don't support a huge military and despise imperialism, think pot should be legal, am against the death penalty, support less jails and more drug rehab (i.e., I think 3-strikes-you're-out is a bad idea), support heavily protecting the environment (e.g., no drilling in ANWR), support women's and minorities' rights (i.e., equal pay for equal work), am against censorship, support privacy (i.e., I think the Patriot Act sucks), support heavy gun control, support alternative energy, support single-payer health care, don't believe in unbridled capitalism nor the military-industrial complex, think social-security, welfare, and medicare are vital to our society, support public education and oppose a voucher system, don't support prayer in school, don't support an open border but do not support laws that limit education and health-care for illegal immigrants...
ReplyDeleteI think I'm on the left...(maybe feeling a bit defensive about the conservative tag).
Wow! I think Vicky might be even more liberal than me!!
ReplyDeleteCrazy! ;0)
Pro Affirmative Action?
ReplyDeleteumm...Euthanasia? Palestine? Heroin needle exchange? Third-trimester abortions? Suffrage? Scary rock race music? Food stamps in liquors stores condoms in schools...funding, Big Government, tax the rich and eat them...
ReplyDeleteDon't worry, there's even people more 'liberal' than I. They waste less and have better diets.
ReplyDeleteAmericore working, ACORN volunteering, community organizing, embryonic stem-cell using, squatting up a tree, labor supporting, Godless, knower of useless knowledge Darwinian....sorry, I'm having too much fun.
ReplyDeleteThe ultimate test...Are you so open-minded that you disagree with yourself?
ReplyDeleteTotally agree with you on the label game. I have some conservative views too. I can't really think of any right now, but I'll get back to you when I do.
ReplyDeleteI'm against neoliberalism.
"Pro Affirmative Action?" That depends. If you mean a quota system, then no, I am not pro affirmative action. Basically I think this is an outdated action and that discrimination in employment should be taken on a case by case basis.
ReplyDeleteEuthanasia...you mean death with dignity, I think, a definite yes. Palestine... to be honest I don't know all the intricacies of what has gone on there and I never commented on this in the GT, except perhaps to say that one of Al Qaeda's gripes is our policy on Israel. I think there have been f-ups on both sides. Heroin needle exchange, yes, it's stupid not to. Third trimester abortions, that one is very tough and I would say that it depends on the situation and I am not clear on where I stand there. Suffrage, how do you mean? Scary rock race music...what is that? If you mean offensive lyrics, then I think they are tasteless but I wouldn't ban them. Food stamps in liquor stores: I don't think anyone should monitor where food stamps are spent as long as they are spent on food. Condoms in schools, yes. Define big government, tax the rich...actually I like the idea of a flat tax but there would be no write offs, definitely eat them.
"Are you so open-minded that you disagree with yourself?"
Yes, I am...no you're not...
I think Afghanistan is a good example of this. I honestly don't know where I stand on it. We shouldn't have ever been there in the first place but we left it a mess when we abandoned it and let the Taliban take over (Charlie Wilson's War was a pretty good synopsis of this).
"But I guess Conservative is the new gay."
ReplyDeleteI've heard that white is the new black this year.
This is where it gets confusing for me. Often times 'Conservatism' really alters things while pretending to preserve them, or it is actually a change in the name of 'conservatism. Not just protecting the status quo, but empowering it or eliminating everything else.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, to me repealing DOMA, and DADT and Bush tax cuts would be conservative, as well as protecting the environment.
Once I heard 'Gay is the new Black,' or put more cutely 'Pink is the new Black.' a couple of years back. I was like, no, I'm pretty sure Black is still Black, except for that one fashion season where it was all about having a Brown wardrobe.
ReplyDelete"'Conservatism' really alters things while pretending to preserve them"
ReplyDeleteYep. Prayer in schools is a good example. If you are truly conservative you should want to protect the separation of church and state as it is stated in the constitution (yes, I know, I know...those exact words aren't in there...). But the religious right are on the 'conservative' side, meaning the right, so their mandate becomes the conservative mandate. Very confusing, I'd say.
"'Pink is the new Black.'"
ReplyDeleteShould have been Rainbow is the new Black.
Let me see, I support low taxes, a small central/Federal Government, with local/State Governments beholden to the People. I support the Constitution (with the 2nd amendment). I support gun control laws that make sense. I am against censorship, and all for privacy. I support our “Strong” military, while I agree that imperialism is a bad thing but don’t think we are imperialistic.
ReplyDeleteI support same sex marriage. On the fence on adoption, I am pro-life; against the death penalty (Until it affects me then I may have to change my mind). I don’t think Pot should be legal. I am all for conservation and environmental protection but think we have gone way too far in some ways.
I do not support socialized medicine; I will not support anymore welfare programs as we are already living with a nanny/welfare State. I support education, and think voucher programs should be given a shot. We’ve poured more money over the years into education will little improvement, why not? I think mandatory minimums (Three strikes) make sense to a point, but think they ultimately take our Judges discretion away. I love capitalism, despise communism, and dislike very much socialism.
I support a closed border and do not support amnesty or any laws that make use of our tax money to pay for “illegal” immigrants to pay for health care or our School systems.
Last but not least, I agree that the separation of Church and State is a good thing. Along with the separation of powers which we seem to get further and further away from each election cycle…
On the fence about adoption? There are many children in the world who do not know what it is like to be loved and protected. Wish so many unwanted children in the world, it is beyond cruel to deny them a loving family that can provide for them.
ReplyDeleteVery true... Well said Ajai. Maybe some good old fashion logic can sway this Republican over...
ReplyDeleteOh wait, Since the Republican leadership can't possibly be swayed how can all us underling sheep be able to see our way through to that new fangled logic thingy?
ReplyDeleteNice post, Corvallisoreugene! Based on some of your positions, listed above, I'd almost call you a "liberal"! Ya left wing nut! Next time, let's have coffee at the bean! ;0)
ReplyDeleteI'm with Ajai on the adoption thing. But, I think if you spent more time with members of the GLBT community, you would, fairly quickly, change your mind.
In the meantime, I'm on the fence about letting evangelical Christians adopt impressionable youth. But, that probably has more to do with my own bias than their ability to raise children.
Just sayin'
The Bean?
ReplyDeleteI will have to see if I can pull out my Burkenstocks, and ty-dye tee-shirt(s)... Kidding aside, let me know your schedule and we'll have to do that. Does the Bean have hot coco? We should all get together!